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Old 06-15-2006, 09:26 PM
JJJJS JJJJS is offline
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Question Yet another iTunes/SuperDuper! question


I just installed SuperDuper! and it seems like an awesome program. I've searched the forums for a response to my question but it seems that everyone in here is more tech-savvy than I am, so some of the responses have gone over my head. Apologies for the newb-ness and the repitition.

Here's the deal: I've got a new LaCie d2 HD Extreme hooked up to my PowerBook G4 and have thusfar put nothing on it for fear of screwing up and then having to start again. Before I copy anything over to the external HD using SuperDuper, I want to make sure I've got the following info straight:

1) I want to use my external HD to back up all the entirety of my PowerBook's harddrive, but I also want to move all of my iTunes music files over to the external drive and keep them there exclusively (I no longer want them on my laptop's harddrive as they take up too much space).

2) So, the question is, once I move the iTunes stuff over the external drive and delete them from my PB harddrive, what happens the next time I run SuperDuper? Will it look into my all-but empty music folder on my PB and say, "Oh! No music files on here, so I'd better make sure the same happens to the external drive!"

- reading through the manual, it seems that the above would happen if I used Smart Update, but not if I used Copy Newer or Copy Different. Is this the case? Would I have to use Copy Newer or Copy Different in order to ensure that the music files on the destination drive weren't erased?

Considering the specificity of my situation (wanting to store iTunes files solely on the external HD but also backup all files from my PB onto the external HD), what strategy would you guys recommend? I appreciate any advice you have to offer.

Thank you!
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:46 PM
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dnanian dnanian is offline
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OK, you should partition the LaCie into two partitions -- a "data" partition (where you'll put your music) and a "backup" partition, where you'll put the SuperDuper! copy.

The best way to copy the iTunes stuff is to create a folder on the "Data" partition called -- for example -- iTunes Music Folder. Then, set your iTunes library to that folder, and use the "Consolidate Library" command to move the stuff up. That'll keep all your playlists and everything as you want them, but move (copy, really) the music.

For SuperDuper!, use Smart Update to maintain an appropriately bootable volume that's up to date.

Hope that helps.
--Dave Nanian
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:38 PM
sdsl sdsl is offline
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I have a comment to add on this -- one of our computers is an older iMac G3 500Mhz with a 20-Gig internal drive. Because the internal drive was so small, I had to move all the photos and music files (used in iPhoto and iTunes) to an external firewire drive. I did this last year and did exactly what Dave describes, which is partition the external drive so that the photo and music files are on one separate partition, and the other partitions are used for SuperDuper clones of the internal HD (which no longer had music and photo files). There is a straightforward way to tell iTunes and iPhoto that you have moved your music and photo libraries/files over to this new location.

The only problem with this is that now the music and photo files are sitting unbacked up on that external drive. So I got an second external firewire drive (they are pretty cheap) and use it to backup all those music and photo files, plus there's plenty of extra scratch space as well for games, videos whatever.
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:45 PM
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dnanian dnanian is offline
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Excellent point. As Chad's story elsewhere on the forums shows, you should always have a backup of files, even those on an external drive. Redundancy helps to prevent loss, whether through a RAID system or through a "real" copy...
--Dave Nanian
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Old 06-17-2006, 08:08 AM
greenjeens greenjeens is offline
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I'm a newb that just finished installing and partitioning a drive for the first time, backing up another itunes library and making a bootable clone.
Don't take my advice as the final word.

Did it, but what a learning process! Feels very satisfying to have all my data safe!
Once one has a great deal of time, money and emotion invested in an Itunes library or photos, it's really important to back these beloved files up. To be safe they need to be backed up on a separate Hard drive.

Having a big empty drive is good, since creating partitions destroys the data. It's also good to wait until you feel like you have the support and good tutorials to start.

I made lots of mistakes, and that's just what happens. Would have been ideal to have a human being to show up and help, but it didn't look like that was going to happen.... So, I just read a lot of posts and instructions. Seems like a Super Duper user group meeting would be a good idea. "Backup" seminars seem like they would have broad apppeal? How may people don't need to backup some data?

One partion should to be set up as a bootable clone to the 20GB (or so) main Mac hard drive. With Super Duper, it's possible to boot up and run from a cloned external firewire drive, making starting up from the cloned drive on one of the partitions easy, if the main HD fails.

First, format and partition the new drive, (which is very simple with Apple tutorials and "disc utility").
Next, use Super Duper to back up all the data, which is safely stored on two hard drives, in case one fails. There is a bit of a learning curve on Super Duper, but most problems were from my own lack of skill. Just read the manual a few times

I went through the exact same process as sdsl, with the first external 200GB OWC FW drive holding a large itunes in a risky, UN-backed up state. lots of people will start with on External drive since the G4 400 only came wiht a 20 GB HD.

After getting the first new OWC 200GB drive full of 150GB of itunes music, (which takes a lot of CD ripping and lots of special audio tools to convert from Laserdiscs, DVD concerts etc), I realized what an investment of time I had! It would take many, many hours, to put it all back together and be a huge drag if that drive failed. Why risk having to start all over from scratch, if the data can be backed up exactly, on another drive usingSuper Duper??

The next step was to buy a second external drive to back up the primary 200GB iTunes library and the 20 GB internal HD.

A 6 year old spinning drive, with lots of expensive applications and customizations etc, seems like a poor bet, expecting it to keep going indefinitely. What a nightmare to start from scratch!

So, to keep from not doing anything at all, because building my own drive was just one more complexity, I didn't want to have to learn how to do for the first time, along with the rest of the information overload, i just bought a plug and play external Seagate 400GB hardrive for $200.

With a large external firewire drive, it's possible to make several partitions. 20 GB for a bootable clone of the internal Mac drive, that's in case the old main HD runs into some kind of major problems. 15GB for photos, 20 for scratch drive, 20GB for something else, like "Sandbox" when I figure that out later. The rest, 315GB, gets the iTunes library backup.

Super Duper allows one to select exactly how to backup each separate partition. Just read everything carefully.
Make sure and select "backup all files" not just the abbreviated "Backup user files". That was unclear, until I did it, and had to start again and select all files, but the original data was still there. The mistakes just cost time, and not a data loss, so it wasn't that tramatic.

I was using automator, but I prefer to manually back up until I can master that function later.
Looking back, there is a lot of things that can be learned refined later in Super Duper.
Backing up manually allows me to see what's going and wait until there have been additions of files that I want to backup, at least for a while. It's pretty fast after the first big transfer of data. Several hours for 150GB! Then just 5-10 minutes with "Smart Backup" .

One important point, which I can't find a good tutorial that explains at the moment, is learning to distinguish the music files, which are the actual "dumb" song files, from the the Itunes application data base.
The iTunes data base knows where on the HD to find the songs listed in the library and playlists.

Seems that keeping the songs on the backup HD as an exact clone is very important, so the iTunes data base doesn't get confused and lose where the the song files are located.

There seem to be a whole bunch of little details, like unchecking "ignore ownership and permissions" on the partition that is to become the bootable HD clone drive, which are required for Super Duper to run correctly.
I don't know how anyone gets all the little settings right the first time, other than paying really close attention to the instructions.

It's impossible, for me anyway, to understand the why's to all the details, without becoming severly overloaded and distracted from completing a fairly simple, step by step backup process.

Here's some good info
iTunes: Moving your iTunes Music folder

If your hard drive is nearly full after loading all your music into iTunes, or if you just want to move all those music files to another hard drive on your system, here's a way to make the move while retaining all your playlists, ratings, and play history.

Good tips to start off the Itunes library database. Unchecking compilations and the "copy itunes library" setting that can create a duplicate library problem.

"some other miscellaneous tips for new itunes users"

For more than you ever wanted to know about hard drives.

Last edited by greenjeens; 06-18-2006 at 08:24 PM.
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Old 06-22-2006, 08:37 AM
JJJJS JJJJS is offline
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Thanks very much for your advice! I partitioned the drive and everything seems to be running smoothly.

Thank you all for your input and suggestions!
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Old 06-19-2006, 03:04 PM
arnaud arnaud is offline
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Originally Posted by JJJJS
1) I want to use my external HD to back up all the entirety of my PowerBook's harddrive, but I also want to move all of my iTunes music files over to the external drive and keep them there exclusively (I no longer want them on my laptop's harddrive as they take up too much space).

What I would do/advise you is to use some ad-hoc app to backup or move your iTunes library, such as iPodRip (not UB) or iPodAccess (UB).
These are great apps.

Then, either you have an iPod either you don't.
Maybe you should consider investing in one, which would be your external drive, and you wouldn't have any problem with your library : all your mp3s would be on your iPod, period.
If you don't have or don't consider buying one, there's a simple solution to use your external drive as your iTunes library BUT you have to have this external drive connected each time you lauch iTunes.

Hope this helps
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